The title of the article is called "Tao Lin Wins His Own Contest and Refuses to Refund the Entry Fee Money to Other Contestants".
This title is incorrect. This contest is my contest, not Tao Lin's. I am Brandon Scott Gorrell. Tao did not refuse to give refunds. 2 people have asked for a refund. The first, 'Jonathan' (he provided no last name), would not give me his email address after I asked for it three times (while he kept asking for a refund and ended the interaction by calling me a homosexual and asking for his refund again)(this is documented in the comments section of this post)(*UPDATE* Carles (Hipster Runoff bro) just told me he was 'Jonathan'). The second person that asked for a refund is 'Herman'. Tao offered me to give refunds if people asked for them, so I sent Tao 'Herman's' email address. Tao told me, 5 minutes ago, that he is going to give 'Herman' the money he asked for "just because he seems to want it alot, not because I've done something wrong." No other contestants have asked for a refund.
"Author Tao Lin's "Muumuu House" publishing company has been accused of embezzling the prize money for its recent short story contest after allowing the editor of Muumuu House (Lin) to win the contest (and the other contestants' entry fee money) when Lin entered the contest with a short story submitted in his girlfriend's name."The contest was not run by Muumuu House. It was run by Brandon Scott Gorrell.
"Baffled, confused, and feeling cheated, many contestants complained about the unfairness of Gorrell's choice"This article does not discuss the contest guidelines page, where I stated that I would allow people affiliated with Muumuu House to join, because I was judging which story I liked best, not which person I liked best. I made this decision the day after the contest started (maybe 2 people had joined by that time). It does not mention that I stated, publicly, in the comments section of the short story contest guidelines, that I predicted liking entries that are "similar in tone to stories of mine, or of writers who's 'work' i enjoy." I then added: "i often enjoy 'work' by contemporary writers such as richard yates, charles bukowski, raymond carver, lydia davis, lorrie moore, jean rhys, frederick barthelme, jean-paul sartre
i often enjoy 'work' by 'internet writers' such as chelsea martin, blake butler, sam pink, tao lin, jimmy chen, zachary german, ellen kennedy, daniel bailey, matthew savoca, jillian clark, victoria trott, matthew simmons, justin dobbs, chris killen, noah cicero, colin bassett, and maybe some others associated with that group of people."
This comment was an attempt to 'bring to light' the possibility that someone affiliated with me could win the competition. I honestly wanted to make this possibility clear.
This article also does not use the information in the video I made, where I stated that I would choose the story that I liked best, and how I believe that this criteria makes the person that wrote it 'arbitrary'. It also does not explain how my choice was unfair, in the context of 'choosing the story I liked best'.
"While in this video Gorrell appears to be faking extreme mental illness, such severe emotional and mental handicaps are generally only considered mitigating factors in a criminal trial, and there are plenty of people in prison with similar pathologies."Exactly what I meant by 'talking shit' in my video. My facial expression, manner of speaking, tone of voice, etc, have 'nothing to do' with the contest, the information coming out of my mouth in that video, or the reasons for my decision. I believe that saying that I look like I have a 'mental illness' has an intent not to reason or inform, but something else.
"The most benign thing that can be said about this contest is that a bunch of people got in over their heads by trying to be cute and clever and accidentally screwed a bunch of people over."No one was 'screwed over'. Contest guidelines were repeatedly stated in several posts on my blog, on websites, other blogs, and discussed. The people that entered the contest, I think, read the contest guidelines, and agreed to them when they entered. Why would someone read a contest's guidelines, join the contest, then complain about the guidelines?
"If this is the case, however, Muumuu House should apologize and seek to repair lost goodwill by choosing a different winner, refunding the money, or turning over judgment of this contest to someone more qualified."The winning story was "Seven Day Caribbean Cruise". This story will stay the winner. Sarah Schneider will still receive the prize because no contest guidelines were broken. I sent Sarah Schneider 80% of the prize today. Two people, out of ~50, have asked for refunds. One person would not give me his email after I asked him for it three times (which, I feel, calls 'into question' if the person 'actually' joined the competition, or is just like 'really retarded') (this takes place in the comments section of this post - 'go see for yourself')(*UPDATE* Carles (Hipster Runoff bro) just told me he was this person), and the second person is 'actually' getting a refund from Tao.
"It's possible, however, that this was a deliberate ploy to defraud gullible Muumuu House fans."It wasn't. Tao didn't know about the contest until the day I announced it. I Gmail chatted with Chelsea Martin about the possibility of doing the contest before I did it. I twittered 'should I do a short story contest on my blog' maybe 2 days before I announced the contest, and one person replied (not Tao). No information about the contest existed anywhere else, before the contest.
I would not 'defraud' anyone, in this way, for the $90 (minus $10 for shipping the prize) that I made ('not to mention' 25 - 35 hours 'working' on the contest, reading submissions, updating, and discussing). I would not 'defraud' anyone for the purpose of 'getting' Tao Lin or any of my affiliates ~$250, 'especially' Tao, because, 'as everyone has seen', he appears extremely adept at making money on his own (e.g. raising ~$12,000 in ~1 week, on his blog, by selling shares of his novel).
"Would you give your rights to a publishing house that finds nothing wrong with defrauding its own fans?"There was no fraud. The contest guidelines were written and discussed in several places on my blog and several websites.
In conclusion, 'Tao Lin Wins His Own Contest and Refuses to Refund the Entry Money to the Other Contestants' states a number of 'things' as 'facts' - that this contest is Tao's contest, that this contest is Muumuu House's contest, that Tao refuses to refund money. These 'facts' are all incorrect. This contest is my contest. Tao does not refuse to refund the money. Moreover, the writer of the article questions the 'legitimacy' or 'fairness' of my competition while, it seems, having not read the short story contest guidelines and other 'basic' information about this contest, and is thus (it appears), working with a 'serious' lack of information, causing, I think, the article to be 'less true' than it would have been if the writer would have read the short story contest guidelines and other 'basic' information about this contest.
Seven-Day Caribbean Cruise
Paul and Michelle were on a seven-day Caribbean cruise. Their cruise ship was stopped at an island in the Bahamas. They stood on the sun deck eating ice cream, looking at the other cruise ships. "Cruise...ship," said Paul, slightly confused about "everything." Michelle stared ahead, at a cloud maybe, feeling vaguely doomed or malnourished. Slowly they moved backwards, away from the railing, and lay on reclining chairs, until nighttime, when they got off the cruise ship, onto the concrete dock, where a tired-looking person robotically said things about "a luxurious casino" as he walked steadily in their direction. Paul, confused, got in the person’s car. Michelle followed Paul into the car. Paul gave the person a twenty-dollar bill.
At the casino Michelle lost $240 on Blackjack.
Outside they stood on a parking lot, below palm trees.
"Seems fun, maybe," said Paul uncertainly.
"No," said Michelle grinning.
Paul, vaguely confused, stared at Michelle, then carefully swiveled his head away, and stared at a scary-looking purple light in the distance. He began walking sarcastically in the light’s direction, his fear increasing then suddenly "disappearing," replaced by a vague belief that walking toward the light would "be good for him, overall, in terms of life." Michelle began walking very fast and was about twenty feet ahead of Paul before experiencing confusion at what she was doing. She slowed until she was adjacent Paul, then smiled kindly at him, but he was staring ahead with a scared face. It was around 3 a.m., Paul knew. Maybe 3:20 a.m. They walked for around three hours in various directions, stopping multiple times, Paul crying once-internally, without "real" tears-and arrived at their cruise ship. They sat on the concrete dock, their legs over water that was maybe fifty feet deep with a sandy bottom that could sometimes be seen.
The top of the sun began rising into view in the distance.
"Huh?" thought Michelle, deliberately not comprehending her reality, and felt herself experiencing "pride" at her behavior. Then a large fish was in the water, about twenty feet below Michelle’s legs, and Michelle felt scared. She thought about screaming, or just reacting in any manner. But she was tired from walking a lot and not sleeping.
"Is that a baby whale?" she said in a quiet voice.
"I think...a jellyfish, or, the lion fish...thing...um," said Paul, beginning to sweat on his forehead. He stared at the "fish" and thought hazily about other things, finally focusing on the phrase "that special hot dog," something from about four months ago. The "fish" blurred in Paul’s vision as he began to salivate a little.
After a while Paul was looking at something that didn’t seem "fish-like."
"Wait," he said, slowly, with mild fear. "Is that...a plastic bag?"
Michelle focused hard on what Paul had said.
"What are you...looking at," she said after ten seconds, honestly confused.
"Um," said Paul.
Twenty seconds passed.
"Um, never mind," said Paul, unsure what he was referring to.
Around 1 p.m. Paul and Michelle were back on the cruise ship, lying on their bed. Paul was asleep. Michelle, alert and blinking a lot, was thinking about throwing a fried chicken leg really far-so far it would keep going, into the horizon, until it became too small to see. She stood suddenly and dizzily walked in an aimless manner toward a piece of a paper on the dresser. It was the day’s schedule. There was ice cream from 1 p.m. to 4 p.m. Michelle wrote "went to sun deck, be back around 2:30" on a "vomit bag" and put the "vomit bag" around the faucet with the words facing up.
"Waffle cone," she thought repeatedly on her way to the sun deck, walking up stairs, then, for some reason, down three floors of stairs. Michelle next perceived herself walking into an elevator with an extreme feeling of loneliness. She stood trembling a little in the elevator. There were other people in the elevator. Michelle moved her neck downward, in a segmented way, and looked at her watch, which seemed to convey that it was 8 p.m.
Michelle stared ahead, at a wall, feeling afraid.
She pushed the button for her deck, waited what seemed like two seconds, and walked out of the elevator, toward her room, feeling either "nothing" or "completely lost in the world." She walked into her room and saw "no Paul" on the bed. Rapidly she began to accept "a life without Paul." She sat on the bed with a feeling of renewal. After an indefinite amount of time Paul came out of the bathroom naked.
They stared at each other.
"Do you want...to...have...play Scrabble?" said Paul.
"Okay," said Michelle
"Do you want a beer?" said Paul, confused.
"Yes, I think that will be funny," said Michelle.
Paul, moving rigidly, as if in an affected manner, though he felt natural in his movements, took two beers from a mini refrigerator and a Scrabble travel set from his backpack. Sunlight was coming in a porthole. Michelle stared at her watch for thirty to forty seconds, finally discerning that it was actually 2:25 p.m. She put the word "hool" on the Scrabble board. Paul stared calmly at "hool" then put "plywood" on the board. Michelle put "or" on the board. Paul made a laughing noise then put "quasars" on the board.
Paul won with 494 points to Michelle’s 221 points.
Paul touched his hair in a weird manner, grinning.
"Do you want to play again?" said Michelle absently, almost accidentally, noticing while saying this that Paul was somehow drinking a strawberry margarita.
Paul’s face displayed no emotion.
He sipped margarita through a twisty straw.
"Um, I don’t know," he said, suddenly nervous. "Not really."
Michelle stared at Paul.
"What do you mean," she said.
"I don’t know," said Paul in a loud voice, grinning. "I kind of want to go to sleep."
"Oh," said Michelle in a voice louder than normal. "Okay."
Paul stood from his chair, staring at Michelle with a tentatively amused expression, and lay on the bed, still staring at Michelle, then slowly closed his eyes while grinning, then slowly stopped grinning. Paul heard himself snoring then felt that he existed inside "a magical land" where he couldn’t do anything, because everyone but himself had magic. He could only sit in a chair, unable to move his arms or legs, as moving itself was a kind of magic, in this "magical land," and for some reason he had a beard that covered his entire head. Paul woke and felt that he was drooling, "a lot," but that a powerful force was stopping him from completely waking, and he could not open his eyes. He felt vaguely "dead" as he sort of "sucked" the drool back into his mouth, more than half-asleep. He lay there experiencing various things in a vague manner.
*
Why Did I Choose This Story?
An Essay by Brandon Scott Gorrell
This story felt like the 'obvious winner' to me, in terms of my experience reading it; considering my level of interest and pleasure, any other story was, I think, 'out of the question'. I have written a detailed analysis below.
[...] Paul, slightly confused about "everything."This excerpt is relevant and makes me feel satisfied.
Slowly they moved backwards, away from the railing, and lay on reclining chairs, until nighttime [...]This excerpt is relevant, makes me feel satisfied, and makes me visualize the scene while processing, in a way that feels new to me, maybe, the passage of time in the sense that Sarah described it, resulting in feelings of focus and I think, 'sweetness'.
Outside they stood on a parking lot, below palm trees.This excerpt is relevant; the emotions perhaps seem complex at the same time 'feeling' sarcastic, maybe creating a feeling that encompasses a number of emotions: happiness, boredom, sadness, and 'fucked', the feeling itself 'blanketed' by a 'layer' of sarcasm that, perhaps, 'nothing can really happen' and choices are, to a certain extent, arbitrary.
"Seems fun, maybe," said Paul uncertainly.
"No," said Michelle grinning.
Paul, vaguely confused, stared at Michelle, then carefully swiveled his head away, and stared at a scary-looking purple light in the distance. He began walking sarcastically in the light’s direction, his fear increasing then suddenly "disappearing," replaced by a vague belief that walking toward the light would "be good for him, overall, in terms of life."The behavior depicted in this excerpt seems like something I would do while feeling 'lighthearted' and 'incredibly sarcastic', I think; my experience of reading it felt like 'calm solidarity' and 'joy'.
Michelle began walking very fast and was about twenty feet ahead of Paul before experiencing confusion at what she was doing. She slowed until she was adjacent Paul, then smiled kindly at him, but he was staring ahead with a scared face. It was around 3 a.m., Paul knew. Maybe 3:20 a.m. They walked for around three hours in various directions, stopping multiple times, Paul crying once-internally, without "real" tears-and arrived at their cruise ship.This excerpt makes me think 'Damn,' and shortly thereafter, while still feeling the 'after-effects' of the excerpt, I experience a confused sense of awe.
"Is that a baby whale?" she said in a quiet voice.This excerpt seems to describe something that is so boring; the feeling similar to watching 'Funny Ha Ha' or 'The Office'; experiencing this feeling includes the recognition of intense relevance, connectedness, and distraction from the feeling 'alone'.
"I think...a jellyfish, or, the lion fish...thing...um," said Paul, beginning to sweat on his forehead. He stared at the "fish" and thought hazily about other things, finally focusing on the phrase "that special hot dog," something from about four months ago. The "fish" blurred in Paul’s vision as he began to salivate a little.
After a while Paul was looking at something that didn’t seem "fish-like."
"Wait," he said, slowly, with mild fear. "Is that...a plastic bag?"
Michelle focused hard on what Paul had said.
"What are you...looking at," she said after ten seconds, honestly confused.
"Um," said Paul.
Twenty seconds passed.
"Um, never mind," said Paul, unsure what he was referring to.
She pushed the button for her deck, waited what seemed like two seconds, and walked out of the elevator, toward her room, feeling either "nothing" or "completely lost in the world."This excerpt is highly relevant; so high, in fact, that I may experience exactly the same sequence of events on an occasional basis, concurrently 'noting', with a sarcastic, self-deprecating 'tone of thought', the experiences as 'significant' in a 'retarded' way.
Paul touched his hair in a weird manner, grinning.This excerpt is amusing; perhaps the 'absurdity' I perceive in regards to the strawberry margarita is 'simply' a 'gimmick' or 'trick' - placed only for comic effect - but, probably, so is everything, in one form or another, for one effect or another, in everything ever written. I have thus come to perceive 'gimmicks' as 'okay', viewing them as 'good' when they are relevant. This one is relevant.
"Do you want to play again?" said Michelle absently, almost accidentally, noticing while saying this that Paul was somehow drinking a strawberry margarita.
Paul’s face displayed no emotion.
He sipped margarita through a twisty straw.
"Um, I don’t know," he said, suddenly nervous. "Not really."
Michelle stared at Paul.
"What do you mean," she said.
"I don’t know," said Paul in a loud voice, grinning. "I kind of want to go to sleep."
"Oh," said Michelle in a voice louder than normal. "Okay."
Paul stood from his chair, staring at Michelle with a tentatively amused expression, and lay on the bed, still staring at Michelle, then slowly closed his eyes while grinning, then slowly stopped grinning. Paul heard himself snoring then felt that he existed inside "a magical land" where he couldn’t do anything, because everyone but himself had magic. He could only sit in a chair, unable to move his arms or legs, as moving itself was a kind of magic, in this "magical land," and for some reason he had a beard that covered his entire head. Paul woke and felt that he was drooling, "a lot," but that a powerful force was stopping him from completely waking, and he could not open his eyes. He felt vaguely "dead" as he sort of "sucked" the drool back into his mouth, more than half-asleep. He lay there experiencing various things in a vague manner.This ending seems like the stupidest, yet sweetest ending 'ever'; again, the 'absurdity' - Paul staring at Michelle; Paul's dream; Paul's beard in his dream - perhaps 'tricking' me into enjoyment, the relevance 'tying it all together for me' - a 'weird' dream stated as 'nothing more than it is', reinforced, I think, by waking, drooling, and continuing to sleep 'halfway'; all of this after the events written before that - a game of scrabble, a margarita, an elevator with people inside, something in the water, a parking lot, a casino, and a cruise ship - seem to make the story 'retarded' in 'the perfect way', or something.
134 comments:
will the author of 'Does Reading This Story Make You Want To Do It?' please contact me, i'd like to read your story
beliefmask@gmail.com
i like the story
damn
sweet story
I like the other story better.
Damn.
"The reading of the fiction of such a minor literary figure as Hjalmar Hjorth Boyesen is valuable for a number of reasons. To begin with, Boyeson was not regarded as minor by his contemporaries... Boyensen's works are confusingly Victorian, just as his contemporaries were confused Victorians and just as most people now are confused Moderns."
Hjalmar Hjorth Boyenson-- Robert S. Fredrickson
i was like, 'this is pretty good', when i read it.
i like the story a lot
thanks brandon
i really enjoyed reading this story. it reminded me of every vacation i've ever been on.
thanks sarah, and good luck
it's not very good. just ripping off Tao Lin's voice, like all of muumuu house
hehe
seems like a good story
i only read like ' half of it'
i have add
but yeah
seems like a good story
There's one problem, Brandon...Sarah Schneder doesn't exist. Tao Lin wrote that story. I read it a month ago, he sent a draft in email...what kind of scam are you guys pulling?
=======================
From: "Tao Lin" binky.tabby@gmail.com
To: michaelhemmingson@yahoo.com
Michelle and Paul, college students on Winter break, were on a seven-day Caribbean cruise. Their cruise ship was stopped at an island in the Bahamas. They were standing on the sun deck eating ice cream and looking at other cruise ships. “Do you want to go outside now, to the Bahamas, I mean,” said Paul, slightly confused about “everything,” and Michelle said she did, and they walked off the cruise ship. A person approached them saying something about a casino. Paul, confused, got in the car. Michelle got in the car. Paul smiled nervously and gave the person a twenty-dollar bill.
At the casino Michelle lost $240 on Blackjack.
“Do you want to take three Advil PM each and then try walking back to the cruise ship?” said Paul outside the casino.
“Seems fun, maybe,” he said uncertainly.
sarah schneider
Shit.
This story seems like a pastiche of anything by BSG.
I prefered the runner-up.
hi michael, thanks for the facebook friend request.
"Brandon...Sarah Schneder doesn't exist."
interesting
please stop making up lies about my story
thank you
you can also follow me on twitter
http://twitter.com/thebluehand
Sarah,
Perhaps "exist" is too existential -- I mean, who really "exists" online but a variety of digital doubles and dopplegangers?
Perhaps your "authorship does not exist" is the correct phrase. Passing off Tao Lin's writing as your own, even if "given" to you, still makes you a fraud.
No biggie -- but how about some integrity and coming clean about it? E.g, what does getting a lifetime MuuMuu subscription mean if the publisher is yr boyfriend and you were an "intern"? ;)
The game was caught. Just cover your tracks better next time.
MH
i didn't like reading it.
michael, here is the email i got from sarah with her story:
"from Sarah Schneider sssssschneider@gmail.com
to brandongorrell@gmail.com
date Tue, May 12, 2009 at 4:15 PM
subject contest (2)
mailed-by gmail.com
hide details May 12 (11 days ago)
Reply
Follow up message
Seven-Day Caribbean Cruise
by Sarah Schneider
Paul and Michelle were on a seven-day Caribbean cruise. Their cruise ship was stopped at an island in the Bahamas. They were standing by a railing on the sun deck eating ice cream, looking at the other cruise ships. “Cruise…ship,” said Paul, slightly confused about “everything.” Michelle stared ahead, at a cloud, maybe, feeling vaguely doomed or malnourished. Slowly they moved backwards, away from the railing, and lay on reclining chairs, until nighttime, when they got off the cruise ship, onto the concrete dock, where they were approached by a tired-looking person robotically saying things about a “luxurious casino” as he walked steadily in Paul and Michelle’s direction. Paul, confused, got in the person’s car. Michelle followed Paul into the car. Paul smiled nervously and gave the person a twenty-dollar bill.[...]"
was not aware of the information in your comment
'either way', if tao did write the story, i stand by my decision on the story
i was transparent about my reasons for choosing the winner and runner up of this contest: "stories will be judged on how much i like them. if stories appear similar in tone to stories of mine, or of writers who's 'work' i enjoy, i predict liking those stories
i often enjoy 'work' by contemporary writers such as richard yates, charles bukowski, raymond carver, lydia davis, lorrie moore, jean rhys, frederick barthelme, jean-paul sartre
i often enjoy 'work' by 'internet writers' such as chelsea martin, blake butler, sam pink, tao lin, jimmy chen, zachary german, ellen kennedy, daniel bailey, matthew savoca, jillian clark, victoria trott, matthew simmons, justin dobbs, chris killen, noah cicero, colin bassett, and maybe some others associated with that group of people" (in the comments section of the original short story post)
i also wrote, in the 'main' short story post, that i would allow anyone to enter the contest, including affiliates of muumuu house: "i have decided to allow people affiliated with 'muumuu house' to join my contest. this will not affect, i believe, my perspective when judging your story or their story (if they choose to enter - none of them has yet). i have made this decision because i feel that there is no 'real reason' to disallow anyone on the basis of 'who they are,' since i am judging 'writing' not 'who a person is'"
the 'point being' that, while i was unaware that tao wrote the story ('if he did'), i 'stand by' my decision on the winner, because i chose the story based on how much i enjoyed it
i explained why and how much i enjoyed this story in my essay in this post: "This story felt like the 'obvious winner' to me, in terms of my experience reading it; considering my level of interest and pleasure, any other story was, I think, 'out of the question'. I have written a detailed analysis below...This excerpt is highly relevant; so high, in fact, that I may experience exactly the same sequence of events on an occasional basis, concurrently 'noting', with a sarcastic, self-deprecating 'tone of thought', the experiences as 'significant' in a 'retarded' way."
in conclusion the person that wrote the story does not account for any part of my decision and i repeatedly stated that, i believe
this was publicly stated here: http://brandon-alien-fine.blogspot.com/2009/04/short-story-contest.html (comments)
here:
http://yeshellofriend.blogspot.com/2009/05/brandon-scott-gorrell-short-story.html (comments)
'anyone' was allowed to join, stated (in update section) here: http://brandon-alien-fine.blogspot.com/2008/05/short-story-contest.html
i explained why i enjoyed the story more than any of the other stories at the bottom of this post: http://brandon-alien-fine.blogspot.com/2009/05/short-story-contest-winner-seven-day.html
i was under the impression that sarah wrote the entry when accepting the entry, reading the entry, judging it, and choosing it as winner
sarah is still the winner, it seems
sarah submitted a story to brandon
brandon assumed that the story was sarah's
'obviously'
brandon chose sarah's story as the winner
if more information is needed email me
in my knowledge brandon followed his guidelines 100%
if more information is needed email me
i have 'back and forth' emails with michael hemmingson, in which the matter was 'resolved,' i feel, that i can forward to whoever
For Tao Lin to say, ' i feel, that i can forward to whoever' and then get Ms Schneider to take credit for his essay, really discredits this competition.
And it just seems really convenient that Tao's essay got chosen to win over the 50 others out there. 2 things could've happened here, 1-Brandon must really love Tao's work to the extent that he can identify with him even when his name isn't on it or 2- Brandon holds Tao's dick at night and to appease it, he let him win so they could split the booty.
While those 2 probabilities may not be true, what is a fact is that Tao is a sham. The authors who have donated in some way to this, should be embarrassed to be attached in what looks like a set-up between an author and his padawan.
Shame
quoting an email i sent michael hemmingson, with some edits for more accuracy:
' be as transparent as possible here is what happened: at some point i 'gave' the story to sarah and she submitted it to brandon's contest. brandon didn't know who wrote the story, and i assume he assumed sarah wrote it, until now [email was cc'd to brandon]. brandon picked the story to win and it won. i have gmail chats with brandon where he won't tell me who won, as he was reading the entries. brandon isn't 'in on' anything 'scamlike' at all.
i try to think of a scam in this and i honestly can't think of one, in anything related to this contest. seems like people 'trade' ideas or drafts or sentences or things often, i've done it before, and it seems accepted conventionally even.'
i feel brandon's contest was run 100% legitimately, if anyone has problems with anything it would probably be me
if anything is directed toward brandon that would be misdirected, i feel
does tao really have a girlfriend who was born in 1989
god damnit, so lame.
This seems fucked. But I am still going to buy Brandon's book. That seems fucked, too. Rad story.
i feel like im going to have to keep responding with the same reply
seems as if this were taken to a 'court' the court would decide in my favor
all guidelines were followed
just keep reading my first two comments 'in defense' of my decision to allow sarah schneider to still 'hold the title' of winning my competition
my decision seems to challenge people's worldviews, or something
it seems really simple to me, though
just read my first two comments
seems ok
why would i 'knowingly' work with tao, considering past history (being extremely transparent, denying multiple people from entering because they wanted to do something 'outside' guidelines), and the imminent shit that would occur; why would i do anything but follow my own guidelines, there seems no logical reason
it wouldn't be worth the $90 to me, or the 'experience with tao', to intentionally deceive over 50 people
keep reading my first two defensive comments and then this one
But why would Tao give his story for Sarah to send in rather than sending it in himself? Maybe Brandon was always telling Tao how he's the greatest writer he's ever read and to test Brandon's allegiance to him, he decided to mask his entry to see if this was really true.
I can only speculate this spectacle that Tao Lin has created...and it was really hypocritical of him to post earlier on this thread 'damn, sweet story'...talk about being in love with yourself. I guess when you wank, you must be looking in the mirror all the time for who could be sweeter than you.
but hey the guidelines were followed to the key and nothing was breached. Thumbs up BooBoo House.
One other thing Tao, this paragraph you wrote-
'i try to think of a scam in this and i honestly can't think of one, in anything related to this contest. seems like people 'trade' ideas or drafts or sentences or things often, i've done it before, and it seems accepted conventionally even.'
we can sum it up in one word, its called plagiarism.
"But why would Tao give his story for Sarah to send in rather than sending it in himself?"
*read this first* brandon had no knowledge about who 'wrote' or 'owned' the story sarah submitted *read this first*
a few reasons, each of which had different levels of influence on the decision:
1. i knew that if brandon chose a story by 'tao lin' to win there would be a massive shitstorm; i knew that brandon knew that, and that it would cause him to feel indecision and worry if i submitted and he liked my story the most
2. i knew that if 'tao lin' won the contest a medium-large or large percentage of people would assume some kind of 'scam' had occurred, even if one had not occurred, due to brandon following his guidelines
3. if sarah won the contest it would be more interested, 'fun,' and 'exciting' for both me and sarah (and everyone else, i feel), to 'see what happens' and 'what people say' and 'what people say about the story,' etc.
4. if sarah won the contest it would promote her blog, damphotos.tumblr,com, and the rest of her internet presence; if i won the contest the effect on my internet presence would be minimal, except that many people would automatically assume or believe that brandon and i had 'scammed' people (despite brandon working ~20 to ~40 hours to 'earn' $90)
5. i wanted to win the $100-$200 i thought i could win from the contest (i currently have ~$1300 in my checking account), and i thought that to have someone else submit would allow brandon to more easily follow his guidelines, which was to pick the story he liked the most as the winner, and if he did that i would have a slightly better chance at winning, i felt, because my 'tao lin' name would not interfere in any way (ways stated in reasons above)
6. sarah and i would 'bond' more if she won the contest
7. the internet would seem funnier and 'happier' to me if sarah won the contest, in ways that would cause life to seem 'more amusing'
8. it would be interesting for me to read brandon's essay on a story i had written that he didn't know i had written
there are probably other reasons
each of the above reasons influenced my decision between .5% and 40%, i think
i honestly believe brandon's contest was the most transparent, comprehensively-explained, and 'contestant-friendly' short story contest i have been aware of, on the internet, based on my memory right now
and that he followed his guidelines 100%
if this seems like anything it seems 'fine' or 'funny' to me
if there are more questions i can answer them
when i masturbated as a teenager i would stand with my side towards the mirror so that i could see the length of my erect penis as i jacked it off.
i think it's sarah's story and that tao stole it. i think sarah should sue tao and take all his money.
"One other thing Tao, this paragraph you wrote-
'i try to think of a scam in this and i honestly can't think of one, in anything related to this contest. seems like people 'trade' ideas or drafts or sentences or things often, i've done it before, and it seems accepted conventionally even.'
we can sum it up in one word, its called plagiarism."
@tsk_tsk i don't feel that plagiarism has occurred; based on memory i think plagiarism is when someone takes someone else's published, copyrighted works and republishes them as their own without first getting permission
in this case i 'gave' sarah the story, it is, to me, like if i gave her an ipod and she sold the ipod to a pawn shop; i would not view that as 'thievery' or anything, just 'seems normal'
it can also be viewed as me selling a short story to a newspaper, and the newspaper then selling it to other newspapers (syndicating it)
there is also a history of people 'sharing' ideas, riffs, sentences; of people having pseudonyms that are deliberately secret; of people 'trading' stories, of people rewriting other people's stories, etc.; this history of 'giving away art' or of 'non-ownership of art' seems to be accepted as legitimate even in the mainstream, even within 'conventional modes of thought'
currently i don't seem to view stories as being 'owned' by whoever, and brandon's guidelines stated he would choose the story he liked best, not basing it on who the author was at all (and isn't that what every contestant seems to want, a contest where the story chosen is based only on the story? isn't that the least 'scamlike' contest possible?) and so in that regard, as well, i view no 'scamlike' occurrence at all
if you have any more questions or accusations i can answer them
Feels like a Top 10 list as to why Tao is not a Dick…allow me to retort Tao
1. Well don’t you feel glad now for averting the potential shitstorm of having Brandon picking a ‘Tao Lin’ written story…yes lying and deceiving people was definitely the way to go.
2. So to avoid a medium-large or large percentage of people from assuming that some kind of ‘scam’ had taken place, you decide to come up with a scam to avoid a potential non-scam…brilliant.
3. Yes Sarah did win the contest and it has gotten somewhat more interesting now as compared with your usual run-of-the-mill contest where the actual writer won the contest…but was it fun? I hardly doubt me and the rest that took part feel that way.
4. So you did this to help Sarah’s blog, what a nice guy. If only Sarah was capable on her own to come up with such an internet presence. I guess you must also write the material in that blog as well, since Sarah lets you write all her stuff.
5. You did this in part to help out your sad bank account of $1300. Yes the rest of us are living on yachts in Monte Carlo, with chambermaids to clip our toenails…I have a sadder bank account than you Tao but that’s not the point. You’ve cheapen the $7 everyone put in for this.
6. So now you’ve bonded with Sarah and must be quite the hero with her for doing her ‘homework’, is that really how you get your girls…sheesh, grow a penis.
7. You did this so life would seem funnier and happier to you…yeah with a total disregard for everyone else cause only you exist in this world of yours…I hope you’ve been amused.
8. So I was right, you did want to see how much Brandon loves you…how self-conceited can you get Tao.
I feel like a dick for entering this contest
Sarah wrote this story several years ago during her junior year of high school. I have a Microsoft Word document on our Gateway 2000 desktop to prove it. Let me know how I can assist in proving that Sarah is the true winner.
This is from dictionary.com-
Plagiarism
the unauthorized use or close imitation of the language and thoughts of another author and the representation of them as one's own original work.
Tao I know you don’t feel that plagiarism has occurred but it has. It matters not if the work came from a published source or not. I got reprimanded for plagiarism in university once for using work that I previously wrote but I did not cite my own writing.
Yes you are right that newspapers do syndicate stories but if you read at the bottom of those stories, most times they would credit the source.
But hey thanks for the laugh when I read this bit-
‘in this case i 'gave' sarah the story, it is, to me, like if i gave her an ipod and she sold the ipod to a pawn shop; i would not view that as 'thievery' or anything, just 'seems normal'
Sarah must be calling all her friends and family now to read this awesome masterpiece she produced, Kudos Sarah.
i entered this contest and do not have a problem with anything that occurred.
i assumed that tao would be entering under a pseudonym and considered entering under a pseudonym myself, only because it would be easier for brandon to read without having any particular feelings or thoughts initially, but then thought that it didn't really matter and that brandon would pick the story he enjoyed reading best, which he did.
it seemed 'possible' to me upon reading the winning story that tao wrote it, because it felt like a story that tao wrote.
the notable thing coming out of this contest is brandon's hidden interest in water vessel literature
This whole pantomime seems really immature and pathetic.
Doesn't look like this is going to do too much good for either of your reputations as serious writers in the long run.
my story about rubies is obviously better
seems like a lot of 'masturbation' and 'penis' references.
if this has helped my blog, then it probably has only helped everyone because i post photos of dams to make people happy.
"6. So now you’ve bonded with Sarah and must be quite the hero with her for doing her ‘homework’, is that really how you get your girls…sheesh, grow a penis."
i feel like this was not a 'homework' assignment, but more like 'extra credit', me being rewarded with your thoughtful comments. i also feel that tao has already 'gotten' me, irrelevant to writing this story. seems like he wouldn't have been successful in doing so if he was in need of 'growing a penis'.
dad, i told you not to post here, i can take care of myself.
"1. Well don’t you feel glad now for averting the potential shitstorm of having Brandon picking a ‘Tao Lin’ written story…yes lying and deceiving people was definitely the way to go."
i don't feel i deceived anyone, seems like i gave sarah a story, she submitted the story that was now hers, brandon read all the entries, brandon chose a winner in a manner 100% consistent with his guidelines, seems 'far away' from anything 'scamlike,' in my view; if anyone has been damaged by this it is me, sarah, or brandon, seems like no one else was affected by this except that it provided 'another forum for shit-talking'
"2. So to avoid a medium-large or large percentage of people from assuming that some kind of ‘scam’ had taken place, you decide to come up with a scam to avoid a potential non-scam…brilliant."
i don't feel i deceived anyone, seems like i gave sarah a story, she submitted the story that was now hers, brandon read all the entries, brandon chose a winner in a manner 100% consistent with his guidelines, seems 'far away' from anything 'scamlike,' in my view
"3. Yes Sarah did win the contest and it has gotten somewhat more interesting now as compared with your usual run-of-the-mill contest where the actual writer won the contest…but was it fun? I hardly doubt me and the rest that took part feel that way."
brandon's guidelines stated he would choose the story he liked best, the author doesn't seem to matter to him, in this case, therefore, if anything, me not submitting anything by 'tao lin' probably only helped everyone else, by making it 'easier' for brandon to follow his guidelines, and focus on the story (seems similar to contests where the names are 'blacked out' to avoid having the judge being influenced by the name rather than the story)
"4. So you did this to help Sarah’s blog, what a nice guy. If only Sarah was capable on her own to come up with such an internet presence."
that is a percentage of the reason why we did what we did, in terms of my own view, not sarah's, i feel; maybe a small percentage, as i feel that sarah probably doesn't 'really' 'care' about her blog, a blog where she posts photos of dams, called dam photos, damphotos.tumblr.com; it seems like anyone is able to promote themselves, but i sometimes have urges to want to promote certain things, for various reasons
"I guess you must also write the material in that blog as well, since Sarah lets you write all her stuff."
i have not written things on that blog; sarah does not let me write all her stuff; i offered, with amounts of sarcasm/irony, to write some of her papers but she declined
"5. You did this in part to help out your sad bank account of $1300. Yes the rest of us are living on yachts in Monte Carlo, with chambermaids to clip our toenails…I have a sadder bank account than you Tao but that’s not the point. You’ve cheapen the $7 everyone put in for this."
brandon's guidelines stated he would choose the story he liked best, the author doesn't seem to matter to him, in this case, therefore, if anything, me not submitting anything by 'tao lin' probably only helped everyone else, by making it 'easier' for brandon to follow his guidelines, and focus on the story (seems similar to contests where the names are 'blacked out' to avoid having the judge being influenced by the name rather than the story)
[continued in next comment]
"6. So now you’ve bonded with Sarah and must be quite the hero with her for doing her ‘homework’, is that really how you get your girls…sheesh, grow a penis."
we probably bonded to some degree, therefore life seems better, in my view; i also bond with sarah, and other people, in other ways, but i am not averse to bonding in ways described in this blog post and comments section
"7. You did this so life would seem funnier and happier to you…yeah with a total disregard for everyone else cause only you exist in this world of yours…I hope you’ve been amused."
brandon's guidelines stated he would choose the story he liked best, the author doesn't seem to matter to him, in this case, therefore, if anything, me not submitting anything by 'tao lin' probably only helped everyone else, by making it 'easier' for brandon to follow his guidelines, and focus on the story (seems similar to contests where the names are 'blacked out' to avoid having the judge being influenced by the name rather than the story)
"8. So I was right, you did want to see how much Brandon loves you…how self-conceited can you get Tao."
yes, that had an influence on me, because it was a possibility that i thought of, as a reason someone would do something like this, and it seems like anything that is a possibility, and that has 'passed through' my head, has an influence on me, however small the influence
"This is from dictionary.com-
Plagiarism
the unauthorized use or close imitation of the language and thoughts of another author and the representation of them as one's own original work."
seemed authorized
"Tao I know you don’t feel that plagiarism has occurred but it has. It matters not if the work came from a published source or not. I got reprimanded for plagiarism in university once for using work that I previously wrote but I did not cite my own writing."
seems funny; hm, i think university has different rules, and brandon's rules were stated comprehensively, and in this case there seemed to be nothing done that 'broke' brandon's rules
"Yes you are right that newspapers do syndicate stories but if you read at the bottom of those stories, most times they would credit the source."
seems like sarah is now the source of the story
there is an artist called mark kostabi, and he has other people make art, and he just signs it, and he got on oprah and didn't have legal problems, i think
this seems to the same thing, or the opposite of that, after factoring in it's the same kind of thing, in some ways, where someone with a larger internet presence makes something and gives it to someone with a smaller internet presence
i'll 'happily' answer any more questions people have
feels easy
well, i guess i don't really care about tao winning the contest, nor does it surprise me since he said he was pretty sure he would win and that it would be under another name. so i wasn't really surprised and i feel very 'whatever' about all of that.
but brandon, not to be petty but i must say that out of richard yates, charles bukowski, raymond carver, lydia davis, lorrie moore, jean rhys, frederick barthelme, and jean-paul sartre, only three are contemporary writers.
anyway, it is a good story, tao. now i'm going to get on an airplane. hope this isn't the last thing i ever say on the internet.
Oh no.
Brandon,
I submitted my story to your contest and I'd like a refund after what has transpired. I thought we would be given a fair chance to compete, but it turns out that you are just another one of Tao Lin's puppets, much like Sarah is.
Thanks,
Jonathan.
"Brandon,
I submitted my story to your contest and I'd like a refund after what has transpired. I thought we would be given a fair chance to compete, but it turns out that you are just another one of Tao Lin's puppets, much like Sarah is.
Thanks,
Jonathan."
brandon's guidelines stated he would choose the story he liked best, the author doesn't seem to matter to him, in this case, therefore, if anything, me not submitting anything by 'tao lin' probably only helped everyone else, by making it 'easier' for brandon to follow his guidelines, and focus on the story (seems similar to contests where the names are 'blacked out' to avoid having the judge being influenced by the name rather than the story)
*note* if anyone believes they were 'scammed' they should email me instead of brandon, as brandon followed the guidelines 100%; if there is any 'abberation' that warrants a refund it would not be inside of brandon, but somewhere else, either through weird laws of logic or some other currently, to me, undiscovered thing, and if somehow those certain 'abberations' occurring outside of brandon had an effect on brandon not following his guidelines, maybe a refund can be arranged; if you are one of those people contact my lawyer here *note*
i don't understand why people are pissed off. brandon hasn't done anything, he just chose the story he thought was the best and thought the author was a girl called sarah.
frick, he was being fair on all accounts.
It seems to be a matter of rhetoric and semiotics -- Tao gave "Sarah" (if she's real) a short story, she "submitted" it and won. "Brandon" (if he's real) said "submit" a story...he didn't say "submit a story you wrote and that is original." In which case, someone I supposed could have submitted a Raymond Carver story and won the "submit a story" contest. Brandon never said it was to be original and yours. If neither Sarah or Brandon are real people but Tao Lin sock puppets, then Tao pocketed all the money...and that is cause for calling out unethical behavior.
But if these people are real...hypothetically speaking...
It's not plagarism; in academics, it would be considered a conspiracy of misrpresentation...if "Sarah" submitted this to a class at NYU, and her prof or admins found out the truth, it would be deemed unethical and she would face expulsion for academic fraud. However, considering that 1/3 of all college students out there turn in papers they bought off a paper-writing site (I know, I used to work for these places) much of our college grads today are frauds, which probably translates to success on Wall Street or the legal system, where much of what we "see" and "hear" is sleight of hand and misdirection. So does engaging in fraud in college actually prepare one for the "real world"?
If Tao is writing all the muumuu books under pen names, and has friends "be" these people using photos, as some have suggested, then it is a curious possibly brilliant ploy -- after all, the two muumuu writers write in exactly the same style as Mr. Lin, so they are either Mr. Lin or Lin cronies/clones who like to imitate Lin.
It is not unlikely that Mr. Lin's publisher has contracted Mr. Lin not to publish competing titles; considering how prolific he is and the long gaps between book publication at Melville, this is not easy for a prolific writer. So what can one do? He is asked not to publish competing "Tao Lin" books, so he publishes books under different names. If exposed, it just creates good publicity.
Could be some wild experiment in identity, online reality, does it matter who is who on the net, duping the public, an exercise in shaping reality with fiction...it's been done many times. I did it in the 1990s, publishing under many names, having many online sock puppets, having them talk to each other...the fact was, I was bored and had too much time on my hands and found the creation of fake people online and becoming them no different than writing stories and novels in the first person and becoming those characters. It was also time-consuming and in the end I could have spent better time on better things.
all things seem to have been explained by my early comments and tao's repeated comments
i chose the story i liked the best
i was clear about how i would choose the winner
i think that some people are confused, such as jonathan
jonathan, you entered the contest; this is a direct acceptance of the terms of the contest, which were not in small print; 'rather' they were made 'extremely' visible, i feel (relative to all other short story contests)
the contest guidelines were never broken
can you explain to me how they were broken
i think you may have a problem with the guidelines of the contest, rather than my decision, because there is (if you or anyone has 'taken the time' to actually 'ponder' this dilemma), i think, one 'issue' with the guidelines that this contest made me realize
the issue is that, under the current guidelines, for example, ryan manning could submit a story that was actually written by richard yates, and if i liked that story the most, i would have had to choose it
this is a 'flaw' or an 'issue' in the contest guidelines, not my behavior or my decision
however, everyone that entered the contest agreed to the guidelines, and i agreed to run it by the guidelines
no one exposed to this contest 'pointed out' that possibility
'once again', everyone agreed to contest guidelines, and no one seemed to have any problem with them
therefore i uphold my decision
jonathan, contact tao about a refund
It's time to come clean...Tao Lin does not exist. I created him as a social experiment in online identity and how many people would believe he's real, and as a way of getting out of my "no competing titles" with my publisher, Thunder's Mouth Press (Blue Moon Books) that no longer exists...but since so many people thought Tao was real, I kept up the hoax and hired this kid in NY I found in a bar on Christopher Street to be my "Tao meat puppet" for public appearances.
Does this mean the muumuu writers and Sarah, et al, are also my creations?
Like a bad Star Trek episode where holograms gain their own hegemony and agency, and get out of control, my Tao Lin personality has been doing things online without my authority, and the fellow in Brooklyn I hired to be Lin now thinks is IS Lin, and I can't stop him, even after cutting off the bi-weekly Paypal payments to maintain the hoax.
A quagmire indeed...
why does this matter?
BRANDON BOOK CRISIS OFFICIAL LEAK:
http://rapidshare.com/files/236864727/The_Brandon_Book_Crisis_Tao_Lin_Gorrell.pdf
Tao have Brandon email me about my refund
If Tao gave Sarah a scratch-off lottery ticket and she scratched it off and it was a winner, would anyone think Tao was the winner?
Contests usually require a lot of luck, this was no different.
I didn't enter, because I felt like if I was 'lucky' I would feel bad, because I own 95% of the books, I didn't want my hard drive back, and I am in an okay place financially.
I like what Tao did. He helped Sarah win a bunch of sweet stuff. She can watch my wedding now.
gay
*shocking question* is sara schneider tao's 'girlfriend'. seems like yes. *shocking question*
"Like a bad Star Trek episode where holograms gain their own hegemony and agency, and get out of control..."
you mean GOOD star trek episode. i loved that one!
"Brandon,
I submitted my story to your contest and I'd like a refund after what has transpired. I thought we would be given a fair chance to compete, but it turns out that you are just another one of Tao Lin's puppets, much like Sarah is.
Thanks,
Jonathan."
jonathan, i believe that you were given a fair chance to compete
can you tell me how my decision wasn't 'fair'?
can you please explain that
'how many times to i have to say' that i chose the winner based on how much i enjoyed the story, and to reiterate that the basis of my judgment was 'clear' from 'day one'
the above facts 'render' the contestant that submitted the story 'moot'
feels like i'm trying to explain something to a 4th grader
can you just explain the way i did not follow the contest guidelines
i'm going to write that two more times, to ensure that see this question
can you just explain the way i did not follow the contest guidelines
can you just explain the way i did not follow the contest guidelines
because i don't see a 'case' where you are owed a refund if guidelines were not broken
which is what i am arguing
please post your reply here
also, i don't have your email address (a number of 'john's' entered my competition, don't know which one you are)
thank you
it's not even that good of a story
so many levels. so many. so deep. so.
i feel like i probably should have seen this coming because tao said he was going to submit several stories under fictitious names
i feel sort of fucked in the way that a teenager feels fucked
kind of lame but funny
maybe this is ironic ?
Brandon Gorrell and Tao Lin,
This is ridiculous. Your insistence on pretending not to understand why people are annoyed, and your trying to give yourself the moral high ground by saying that what you did was great and honest and good for literary contests (or something) is kind of amazing.
1) The contest rules state that the winner of this contest is based on how much Brandon Gorrell "enjoys" their story.
2) Based on the clear influence of Tao Lin's, um, literary style on that of Brandon Gorrell, and on their ongoing relationship as friends and publishing house affiliates, it's pretty safe to assume that Brandon Gorrell is naturally more likely to "enjoy" the work of Tao Lin than that of other people.
3) This is normal. For most people, the writing of friends (especially admired friends, who have influenced one's own writing) just seems more relevant than other writing--and is thus "more enjoyable" than other writing, if personal relevance is your main criterion for enjoyment, which it seems to be for Mr. Gorrell.
4) When I read that Tao Lin and all of Brandon's other friends were going to be in the contest, I assumed that this was merely a humorous way to get the public to participate. As if Brandon Gorrell were saying to the public, "oh no, if more of you guys don't participate then my friends are just going to WIN THE CONTEST." I assumed that Brandon Gorrell was not, in fact, going to let his friends win the contest, even if he "really enjoyed" their stories and really found them "more relevant" than the others--especially not the friend who appears to be his No. 1 influence, Tao Lin. Otherwise, the contest wouldn't prove anything, except that, yes, Brandon Gorrell really enjoys the writing style of Tao Lin. It would not really be a "contest."
5) For similar reasons, I assumed that Tao Lin would not covertly submit entries under different names--we already know that Brandon Gorrell likes Tao Lin's writing more than that of other people. Tao Lin winning this contest, under any name, is like if the Ayn Rand Institute ran an essay contest and Ayn Rand won (while she was still alive). Although, of course, I am not implying that Mr. Gorrell's literary tastes are as dogmatic as the Ayn Rand Institute's.
5) You guys are right. None of points 2-5 were stated in the contest rules. I was mistaken to read the rules in such a way as to suggest that this was a contest to see what writing Brandon Gorrell will find the most relevant/enjoyable, out of that which has not been written by his friends.
Perhaps this contest was a good opportunity for Brandon Gorrell and Tao Lin to play a trick on the public, or, uh, to demonstrate the exploitative nature of literary contests, or for Tao Lin to really, I guess, bond with his girlfriend (?). But, to keep insisting that this is a good and moral and fair literary event that has taken place, and to believe in this, is to act in what Jean-Paul Sartre (I hear he is another influence on this "Tao Lin literary movement"?) would call "bad faith."
- Alex Solomonik
1:14 PM me: damn really
fucking bitches
is your gf sara schnieder?
Tao: yes
"
its true. some things were never mentioned. and you can twist it all you want and no one would be able to accuse you of anything. but trying to act like you don't understand why people are upset is ridiculous.
and if you guys need the money that bad. then you can keep my $7. seriously. but if you really needed it that bad you probably would have gained more integrity by just begging for it on street corners. because you have now possibly lost any fans you had.
@alex "You guys are right. None of points 2-5 were stated in the contest rules. I was mistaken to read the rules in such a way as to suggest that this was a contest to see what writing Brandon Gorrell will find the most relevant/enjoyable, out of that which has not been written by his friends."
i stated in contest updates: "i have decided to allow people affiliated with 'muumuu house' to join my contest. this will not affect, i believe, my perspective when judging your story or their story (if they choose to enter - none of them has yet). i have made this decision because i feel that there is no 'real reason' to disallow anyone on the basis of 'who they are,' since i am judging 'writing' not 'who a person is'"
"But, to keep insisting that this is a good and moral and fair literary event that has taken place"
don't think that anyone ever used the word 'moral'
i implied fairness by stating that contest guidelines have been followed, never broken; i stand by the implication
watch my video in the post above this one, and read the paragraphs that follow it
"its true. some things were never mentioned. and you can twist it all you want and no one would be able to accuse you of anything. but trying to act like you don't understand why people are upset is ridiculous."
not trying to act like i don't understand why i don't understand why people are upset
see comment in this thread: "i think you may have a problem with the guidelines of the contest, rather than my decision, because there is (if you or anyone has 'taken the time' to actually 'ponder' this dilemma), i think, one 'issue' with the guidelines that this contest made me realize
the issue is that, under the current guidelines, for example, ryan manning could submit a story that was actually written by richard yates, and if i liked that story the most, i would have had to choose it
this is a 'flaw' or an 'issue' in the contest guidelines, not my behavior or my decision
however, everyone that entered the contest agreed to the guidelines, and i agreed to run it by the guidelines
no one exposed to this contest 'pointed out' that possibility
'once again', everyone agreed to contest guidelines, and no one seemed to have any problem with them
therefore i uphold my decision"
i also reiterated why people may be upset in my video that is above this post
i can't even sit through that video. it's too long and awkward.
damn
I think that this contest was kind of the equivalent to that nasty uncle who says "Hey, gimme that quarter, I'll show you a magic trick" and then he chuckles and slaps you on the back of the head and says "Now you know!" And you don't get your quarter back.
i think this contest was the equivalent of a highly transparent short story contest
Brandon, yes your guidelines have not been broken and the winning entry complies to it. Yes, the participants did agree to the guidelines you set. The reason why no one protested against it was because at the time, everyone must've felt that there was a degree of integrity and morals within the BooBoo house...how wrong we were...people didn't speak up initially because somethings like this are blatantly obvious and to point them out would seem silly.
this is seriously fucking bullshit and Tao and Brandon need to be brought down. I expect a refund of money so that I don't lose any thing from the paypal transaction fee.
Please refund this money asap or else I will notify the New York State Consumer Protection Board of your wrongdoings.
I will also be sure that Sarah Schneider is audited and all entities who gained money from this are properly taxed
jonathan
damn
did you even read my comment in reply to yours
you havent even given me your email address
i asked for it
then said some other things implying that i wouldn't refund your money
i asked a certain question 3 times in a row, so you would be 'forced' to answer it
you still didnt answer it
did you even read my reply to you
stop acting like a homosexual and refund my money you fucking asshole
jonathan
i have asked you twice for your email
are you reading my comments
i have asked you
"can you just explain the way i did not follow the contest guidelines
i'm going to write that two more times, to ensure that see this question
can you just explain the way i did not follow the contest guidelines
can you just explain the way i did not follow the contest guidelines"
and
"did you even read my reply to you"
probably not going to respond to you anymore unless you answer my questions, or something, i keep repeating myself
it seems extremely 'crystal' clear to me that all issues brought against this contest are issues with what tao did and not what brandon did.
anyone could have 'fooled' brandon in a number of ways, he acted entirely within guidelines.
it seems very ridiculous to me to talk about problems inherent to the contest rules after the contest has taken place.
in other news:
i am going to hold a contest on my blog in which the winner receives the full copyright of the story that i entered in this contest which made it to the second round (the 'contest: maybe' round)... further news coming about this soon
this is like looking at a car wreck: no one wants to say, 'hey, that guy's head is no longer connected to his body.'
i'd just like to post this here as well. take from it what you will. i feel like an explanation from me would be redundant or something.
i consider my $7 to be a muumuu house donation and i'm okay with that.
funny
Brandon, Tao Lin & Sarah, you guys must really be constipated cause you're all full of shit.
Brandon,
Did you read what I wrote? I had seen your note saying you said you were allowing Muumuu House writers to enter the contest, but I didn't believe you would let them win, since--given one's natural preference for the writing of one's mentors--doing so would obviously be unfair and obviously make this be not a real contest. I literally thought you were joking.
To say that the contest was fair because its unfair guidelines were stated beforehand doesn't make sense to me.
Like a few others, I found that the $7 entree fee was worth it for the spectacle. I don't think Tao Lin is necessarily a "bad" writer, but the work of Lin and his "school" always feels, to me, to have this combination of mean-spiritedness and, somehow, moral stridency. His/your actions in this contest also display these qualities to a high degree. I find this unity between a person's life and work to be aesthetically pleasing.
As for nobody using the word "moral" in these comments: both you and Tao Lin suggest on multiple occasion that your actions in this contest somehow promote the cause of justice, a moral value. Tao Lin also suggests that his actions in this contest promote the cause of literature and aesthetics on the internet (e.g. people will get to see more pictures of dams), an important moral value for him.
- Alex
gay
Jonathan,
You can always file a scam complaint with Paypal to have the fee reversed. Suggested for all others to do the same, and the money will simply be taken out of Brandon's bank account and he could lose his Paypal account for engaging in criminal fraud. Someone may also notify the administration at NYU that Sarah Schneider may not be turning in class papers that she wrote, but written by someone else, since she can't do her own writing.
hey, like, wow, you know, like, i totally heard from peeps @ New York U that sarah schneider is an alcoholic whore who drinks so much beers that she will go to bed w/anyone after a 12-pack, and she cheats on tao lin all the time but he may be too blind to see it. she has quite a rep as a "doorknob" in pennsylvania too, like, "everyone takes a turn." hey i dunno if this is true i just report what i hear and i hear that from a lot of peeps here at New York U (where i am a student too) and her name and number are in every men's bathroom: "for NY's finest bj, call sarah." i guess she puts out for words and beer!
brandon if you faced the situation where shoplifting would enable you to publish a book what do you think you would do??
you're coming off like an asshole brandon. just apologize. sarah didn't win.
ok I think I know what is going on here --
Tao Lin "gave" one his short stories to his squeeze box to put her name on and pass off as her own.
Tao has also "given" some of his work to Brandon and Ellen and published it as theirs. Hemmingson could be right that Tao's agreement with Melville House states he cannot publish other books that compete with the ones they put out, so...
We have a bunch of talentless 20-something writers who can't write anything publishable who have a friend named Tao Lin with an abundance of talent, so he "lends" his talent to them, "gives" them his work, then publishes it, so it not exactly self-publishing, and his talentless friends get to go around pretending they're writers like him.
This is why Brandon and Ellen's work "looks" so much like Tao's...because IT IS!
Crazy peoples.
"you're coming off like an asshole brandon. just apologize. sarah didn't win."
read tao's comments, my comments, (specifically "i think [people] may have a problem with the guidelines of the contest, rather than my decision, because there is (if [...] anyone has 'taken the time' to actually 'ponder' this dilemma), i think, one 'issue' with the guidelines that this contest made me realize
the issue is that, under the current guidelines, for example, ryan manning could submit a story that was actually written by richard yates, and if i liked that story the most, i would have had to choose it
this is a 'flaw' or an 'issue' in the contest guidelines, not my behavior or my decision
however, everyone that entered the contest agreed to the guidelines, and i agreed to run it by the guidelines
no one exposed to this contest 'pointed out' that possibility
'once again', everyone agreed to contest guidelines, and no one seemed to have any problem with them
therefore i uphold my decision"", the contest guidelines, the video in the post above this one, and the paragraphs that follow it
brandon the situation has moved on since the situation of the original agreement of entering the competition - i.e. people's reaction. it seems like you dont credit peoples reaction at all
"Did you read what I wrote? I had seen your note saying you said you were allowing Muumuu House writers to enter the contest, but I didn't believe you would let them win, since--given one's natural preference for the writing of one's mentors--doing so would obviously be unfair and obviously make this be not a real contest. I literally thought you were joking."
yes i read what you wrote. sarah schneider is not a muumuu house writer. i was under the impression that she wrote the story when she submitted it. i chose 'sarah schneider' not 'tao lin'.
moreover i was not joking when i said that i would allow muumuu people to join, because i wanted to judge the best story (in my opinion), not the best person. i read every entry and considered which i liked the best. will stop repeating myself soon
"To say that the contest was fair because its unfair guidelines were stated beforehand doesn't make sense to me."
i think [people] may have a problem with the guidelines of the contest, rather than my decision, because there is (if [...] anyone has 'taken the time' to actually 'ponder' this dilemma), i think, one 'issue' with the guidelines that this contest made me realize
the issue is that, under the current guidelines, for example, ryan manning could submit a story that was actually written by richard yates, and if i liked that story the most, i would have had to choose it
this is a 'flaw' or an 'issue' in the contest guidelines, not my behavior or my decision
however, everyone that entered the contest agreed to the guidelines, and i agreed to run it by the guidelines
no one exposed to this contest 'pointed out' that possibility
'once again', everyone agreed to contest guidelines, and no one seemed to have any problem with them
"Like a few others, I found that the $7 entree fee was worth it for the spectacle. I don't think Tao Lin is necessarily a "bad" writer, but the work of Lin and his "school" always feels, to me, to have this combination of mean-spiritedness and, somehow, moral stridency. His/your actions in this contest also display these qualities to a high degree. I find this unity between a person's life and work to be aesthetically pleasing."
'no idea'
"
As for nobody using the word "moral" in these comments: both you and Tao Lin suggest on multiple occasion that your actions in this contest somehow promote the cause of justice, a moral value. Tao Lin also suggests that his actions in this contest promote the cause of literature and aesthetics on the internet (e.g. people will get to see more pictures of dams), an important moral value for him."
i have been 'reasoning' this whole time, it feels; don't know
you thought you chose sarah. you chose tao. can you stop defending sarah? it doesn't make sense.
it wouldn't be honest for ryan to enter under yates. it's not honest for sarah to enter under tao. theres something wrong about it.
"brandon the situation has moved on since the situation of the original agreement of entering the competition - i.e. people's reaction. it seems like you dont credit peoples reaction at all"
i think you may have a problem with the guidelines of the contest, rather than my decision, because there is (if you or anyone has 'taken the time' to actually 'ponder' this dilemma), i think, one 'issue' with the guidelines that this contest made me realize
the issue is that, under the current guidelines, for example, ryan manning could submit a story that was actually written by richard yates, and if i liked that story the most, i would have had to choose it
this is a 'flaw' or an 'issue' in the contest guidelines, not my behavior or my decision
however, everyone that entered the contest agreed to the guidelines, and i agreed to run it by the guidelines
no one exposed to this contest 'pointed out' that possibility
'once again', everyone agreed to contest guidelines, and no one seemed to have any problem with them
therefore i uphold my decision
i don't have a problem with the guidelines i have a problem with the fact that people were upset and you can't see a problem at all your end
"you thought you chose sarah. you chose tao. can you stop defending sarah? it doesn't make sense."
i am and have been defending my decision
if people were attacking sarah, wouldn't they be doing it on her blog, or something
why would i spend 'all this time' defending sarah
and why would all these comments, on my blog (over 120) be directed at sarah and not me
"it wouldn't be honest for ryan to enter under yates. it's not honest for sarah to enter under tao. theres something wrong about it."
"in this case i 'gave' sarah the story, it is, to me, like if i gave her an ipod and she sold the ipod to a pawn shop; i would not view that as 'thievery' or anything, just 'seems normal'
it can also be viewed as me selling a short story to a newspaper, and the newspaper then selling it to other newspapers (syndicating it)
there is also a history of people 'sharing' ideas, riffs, sentences; of people having pseudonyms that are deliberately secret; of people 'trading' stories, of people rewriting other people's stories, etc.; this history of 'giving away art' or of 'non-ownership of art' seems to be accepted as legitimate even in the mainstream, even within 'conventional modes of thought'
currently i don't seem to view stories as being 'owned' by whoever, and brandon's guidelines stated he would choose the story he liked best, not basing it on who the author was at all (and isn't that what every contestant seems to want, a contest where the story chosen is based only on the story? isn't that the least 'scamlike' contest possible?) and so in that regard, as well, i view no 'scamlike' occurrence at all"
"i don't have a problem with the guidelines i have a problem with the fact that people were upset and you can't see a problem at all your end"
do you think, if i didn't see that people were upset, i would be commenting, repeatedly, my reasoning for upholding my decision
have you read any of this comment section (of which i've commented 15+ times), watched my video (6 mins), and read the paragraphs under the video (post above this one)
don't see how you think i 'don't see' that some people are upset
seems, also, that one person wants a refund, but after asking him 3 times for his email address, he still didn't give it to me
i feel like i shouldn't clog this up further. but i do feel like brandon saying "i chose 'sarah schneider' not 'tao lin'" is important to this internet conversation.
if you're trying to give the guy a refund then i don't see a problem. fair enough
you have more loyalty to tao and sarah than the contestants. its disappointing to be honest.
"moreover i was not joking when i said that i would allow muumuu people to join, because i wanted to judge the best story (in my opinion), not the best person. i read every entry and considered which i liked the best. will stop repeating myself soon"Yes, but it's obvious that you are more likely to find the writing of someone you already relate to on a personal level "more enjoyable" than other writing of comparable quality.
If I had a good writer friend who was even remotely competent, and they submitted a story to me under a different name, I would think, "Wow, this story seems really relevant--it's like this person has had similar life experiences to me. In fact, this story almost seems like something one of my friends would write."
However, because that story would actually have been written by one of my friends, my feelings of the story's "relevance" would have a high chance of being due to something other than the skill of the writer (which, as it is, can be difficult to measure). Even if I didn't initially know that the writer was my friend, I would obviously prefer his story.
It's like in Wagner's Ring Cycle, when Siegfried thinks that he has found his soulmate in Sieglinde, not realizing that Sieglinde is in fact his long-lost twin sister.
Brandon, maybe it is romantic for you to "discover" Tao Lin's writing like this, in another guise, but it's not really a fair way to judge a contest of literary skill, which I guess you are saying this wasn't.
- Alex
P.S. I can explain why I find Tao Lin's writing to be mean-spirited and strident later, I have to write a paper now.
The issue isn't whether or not you followed the guidelines; the issue is bad faith.
It's true and obvious that at no point were any guidelines broken. You also argue that the issue should be "which story is the best; the person doesn't matter." On the strength of these two points, you argue that this competition is totally legit, and that people who are upset about the results are incorrect/have no reason to complain.
This is what we call acting in bad faith. As a fan of Sartre you should sort of be familiar with this. "Obviously" you and "Tao Lin" share many of the same "neurotic" stylistic interests, to a degree that is maybe "unhealthy." Tao Lin is your friend. Tao Lin is your publisher. You probably talk with Tao Lin at least twice a week or so. Thus: people gather together $7 to enter a literary competition on the strength of your being Tao Lin's friend/a Muumuu house affiliate basically. Then Tao Lin enters the contest secretly and you award him the prize unknowingly.
That's not the issue, although it is a good object lesson as to why you don't allow people you have personal relationships with to enter contests with money involved basically: because it pisses people off and makes you look terrible even if you did not do anything wrong according to the guidelines.
The issue is that you think that saying these two points over and over--(1) I didn't do anything wrong according to the guidelines, and (2) it shouldn't matter who the writer is if the story is good--means that no one can or should complain about what you are doing, that their complaining means that they just fail to understand that really, you did follow the guidelines! The issue is that you're holding yourself to these guidelines that you admit, retroactively, are flawed, but you're still all like "oh shit guess my hands are tied, no you can't have your money back, also it is okay that my friend and publisher was better than everyone else in the world in this case"
Would you at least change it to "Congratulations to Tao Lin" now that you know who the actual author of the story is? Authorship isn't like having an iPod; you don't assume from the fact that someone owns a particular iPod that you can understand something about them on the strength of looking at that iPod closely, when this is just an unavoidable conclusion with literature.
(It should be also pointed out, for the record, that this story sucks. I feel we are all losing sight of this point in the tumult. "Michelle moved her neck downward, in a segmented way, and looked at her watch, which seemed to convey that it was 8 p.m." What does that even mean? What are the segments into which moving your neck "downward" can be divided? How is it interesting to cast _metaphysical doubt_ on the question of whether or not the time your watch displays is *actually the time*? Also you can not walk "in an aimless manner toward a piece of paper on the dresser." Also I think that if you are actually depressed enough to feel that "everyone but yourself has magic" that it is a good idea for the sake of the world to try to grow beyond this, to deepen your connection with other human beings via taking personal risks in your work, rather than just to mine a trendy emotion for e-fame, ca$h and laffs about a cruise ship. This last is kind of a personal problem I have with Tao Lin's work though that obviously you don't have, and also maybe the other stories sucked worse; I don't know.)
Basically it would be nice for everyone, I think, if you just said "I understand why people are angry that the winner of the money from my short story contest is my good pal and publisher. Next contest will be better folks" or really anything to acknowledge that there is some critical dissimilarity between your adherence to "the guidelines of the contest" and "your soul in the world," your "obligation to treat other human beings as ends in themselves rather than vague threats from which you must hide"
In conclusion, this is your contest, man: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ye14HG2KAUw
-john thornton
i feel i am responding to no more comments
even though many commenters, i have observed, seem to not read or acknowledge comments i or brandon have made while they repeatedly type more comments, i encourage commenters to read previous comments i or brandon have made to know my thoughts, which i feel have been made available comprehensively, at this point
i will reiterate that brandon followed his guidelines 100%, and if someone feels 'wronged' it can only be at my behavior, which does not have anything to do with brandon or his contest, in terms of who to direct shit-talking toward
feedback about the short story contest, gossip on my promiscuity, and updates of my potential NYU expulsion can be redirected here:
http://www.tumblr.com/tumblelog/damphotos
working link re sarah schneider comment:
dam photos
Another possibility for all this: Dow and Brandie intentionally conspired to "choose" the worst-written story just to see what people would say, get them mad, and maybe even make social commentary on the whole fallibility of "contests." I read somewhere that Raymond Carver's first collection was rejected by a lot of contests for years and look where it went!
As others have pointed out, the story isn't good, it has typos and awkward, strange exposition. Also: it's dumb. On the other hand, after reading Sarah's poems on her blog, it is a leap of improvement! This girl has zero talent as a poet and there should be laws against doe-doe little booze floozies who write this crud. So, feeling sorry for her inability to put two sentences together, her bf Dow Limb gave her one of his worst stories, with the intent that his butt buddy, Brandie Golem, would pick it and give her a public ego boost.
But now she has been exposed: a literary mooch like so many women have been over time.
Hey, Sarah, lemme whisper this into your sweet beer-stained ear: "You are no Simome de Beavior to your bf's Sarte, ya filthy tart."
And go shower, girlfriend, you smell a cum bucket that spent 48 hours in a frat house, "Spectacle Queen" written on your forehead.
:)
What do you know. The money stays in the family.
I think you should have gone for the gold. A $20 submission fee and you should have run it for like six months. Then you'd have pulled a few grand. It would have been better.
As a way to make ammends you should publish all the entries to the contest, so people can read them--and so the entrants don't feel like they were just ripped off. You could do it either as an ebook, a series of posts on muumuu house (maybe like one story a day until they're all gone), or even as a real book--"the brandon story contest crisis."
Whether or not you followed the rules (which is the basis of your argument), I have to say this whole thing really casts muumuu house in an poor light. The integrity and honesty of the whole house looks suspect. The contest at least looks substantially unfair, scammy, and as someone else said 'mean-spirited,' even if all the rules were followed.
And that's a shame because a lot of what Lin is selling has to be bought on faith. Selling shares in his second novel? People aren't likely to invest if they think there's some kind of trick involved like there was with this contest. Lifetime subscriptions? People have to trust that you'll actually follow through with that years from now.
Regardless of whether the rules were 'flawed' or not, people here feel cheated. I would absolutely think twice before entering any kind of contest related to muumuu house again.
exadore, seems like you haven't read the guidelines to brandon's contest, brandon's comments, my comments, and the post above this post
Is that your stock response now? I read your comments, brandon's comments, and the guidelines. You just keep saying the same things. Did you read mine? I didn't accuse you of breaking the guidelines. The post above mine said something about the money staying in the family? Not sure how that's relevant.
I'm not saying you broke the rules. I'm saying regardless of the rules (and regardless of how many times you refer to not breaking them), people feel cheated. You have brought more 'pain and suffering' into 'the world', whether you meant to or not. I'm not even that angry, I'm just saying the whole thing looks really shady. Acknowledge that. Please. And because it looks shady, I wouldn't enter a contest or buy a subscription because of it. Because it makes you look shady.
I'm trying to help you out here. I'm trying to give you a solution where the winner of the contest doesn't have to change but the contestants can feel like you and brandon are really 'okay dudes' who didn't intentionally try to pull a 'scam' on them.
Seriously, to reduce the 'pain and suffering' you have brought 'into the world,' I think it would be useful to publish the entered stories. It would make the people who entered feel like you 'acted in good faith' and that the whole thing wasn't 'a scam' from 'the start.' You know, just to say "hey guys, thanks for entering the contest. Sorry you're not happy with the admittedly flawed guidelines/how things turned out, but to show you we're not assholes, all your stories will be published for everyone to read."
It wouldn't even cost anything if you did it on the muumuu house site. In fact, you would probably get links from those writer's blogs and their friend's blogs, thus increasing traffic and generating 'mad hits.' What's the problem with that?
exadore, i have been thinking about doing a pdf
one reservation i have about doing a pdf is that it may actually increase shit talking (people saying 'sarah's story sucked, [...]'s story was way better. just more evidence that muumuu house scammed us'
i have this reservation because a lot of people have said that the winning entry was a 'bad' story, and using that as 'evidence' that the contest was a scam
'either way' i have been thinking about doing something like that, and i feel that the idea is maybe something good for me to do, just not sure yet, because i'm not sure what it would 'prove' other than that ~50 other people did enter the contest
feel afraid it would cause more shit talking than 'good'
however, it would get the author of the story hits
seems like it could create like a month long controversy, just by people shit talking the winning story and comparing it to [whatever] story, and saying why [whatever] story was 'obviously' better, and maybe things like 'this just proves brandon only likes writing that "mimics" his'
which appears to offend people
thank you for offering your help exadore
Comment #3 on this post:
"Tao Lin said...
damn
sweet story"
That is all I need to call this an intentional scam. I, too, think refunds are in order, but I know people who have no shame don't give money back.
I once thought that I at least agreed with Tao Lin's writing philosophy, (even if I don't enjoy his writing too much), i.e. writing things that would stand on their own instead of being responses to what has come before (even though we could argue that Lin's work is responding to, say, Lydia Davis), and this is despite my being very much attached to metaphors and similes. But now I just feel that it is part of a lie to make his writing more "serious" and "creditable."
Too many lies, too many lies. This is one more.
seems like i feel comfortable getting people to trust some entity by showing factually how the entity can be trusted, by showing logically that the entity did not act in a way that would cause damaging things to happen to people that don't want it (addressed in previous comments), logic seems sustainable, whereas if instead of explaining logically and factually what happened i bypassed that, and in doing so implied that some people had been 'cheated,' then 'just' did things to appease people it would give a message of something like 'it's okay to "scam" people as long as you appease them afterward'
i feel more comfortable explaining why factually my behavior did not harm anyone outside of guidelines that everyone had agreed on by entering the contest
seems like many people will look at the facts and still distrust me, or something, and i feel that is something i can accept
*note* sentiments alluded to in this comment have been expressed more fully and maybe more accurately in other comments i have made *note*
boulder, seems like over 50% of commenters on this post and the post above are people that didn't enter the contest
there has been only one person that has asked for a refund and i asked for his email three times (as i've said 3+ times) and this person ('jonathan') never gave me his email, making it impossible to give if a refund, 'even if i was to do that'
seems also that if tao saying 'sweet story' is 'all it takes to convince you that this contest is a scam' that you are operating on the basis of a 'serious' lack of information
"Too many lies, too many lies. "
can you explain that? how did i lie?
You two guys:
Insisting you have not broken the guidelines is perhaps like Mike Tyson insisting that there is no specific rule stating he cannot chew his opponent's ear off -- even though you are "technically" correct, it does not mean you are "right."
For people who shoplift you sure do place a lot of importance on some stupid written man-made "rules" huh.
'Paul touched his hair in a weird manner, grinning'
made me laugh so much.
i acknowledge my defeat.
'one day i will be a great writer like my boyfriend and my heart will flutter and i will grin and shrug and say it was so easy, like building a dam'
a poem my sarah schneider
i look into the bathroom mirror
touching my hair in a weird
manner, grinning,
and i say, "you have no talent"
and i close my eyes and envision
myself looking into a rear view mirror saying, "you have no talent"
and as i look in the rear view mirror i my reflection 3 cars back
looking into a rear view mirror
and saying, "you have no talent."
i open my eyes and shrug
i open a beer and sit down on the couch and i watch adult swim and
aqua teenhunger force is on
and i think, 'i would be sweet
to be just like meatwad because he's so sweet.'
i get on gmail and brandon is there
brandon: shop lift with me
sarah: sure, what will we steal?
brandon: art
sarah: how about integrity?
brandon: i could steal me some of that
sarah: let's go do some crimes
i talk to tao on the phone and he's like, 'hey, i'm going to give you this story and you'll submit it to this contents and you'll win and we'll collect the entry fees. sweet, huh?'
i ask how does he know we'll 'win'
and he says, 'it's in the bag'
i have a bad flashback of this frat boy at a party who i gave a hummer to and he said i was only good for sucking dick and he said, 'i wouldn't do you with a bag over your face.'
that was not nice
who is nice?
on tv, master shake is not nice to meatwad and it makes me sad
i open another beer
i'd like me some meatwad i think as i sit in a coffee shop with my laptop and i am on gmail with this cute guy across the way in the coffee shop and later we leave and he does not put a bag on my face and i think that's so sweet
tao will give me enough of his writing for a book that he will publish and the book will be called, 'i sit in a coffee shop with my laptop and i am on gmail with this cute guy across the way in the coffee shop and later we leave and he does not put a bag on my face and i think that's so sweet'
P.H.M. -- That is exactly the issue of many 'contests' out there and why the CCLM has put into place guidelines for its members so no contest will do this...many of the 'first book of poetry or stories' contests you see from new small presses are scams...they have a book they want to publish, maybe by the publisher or his spouse or friend, but no money to do it, so they announce a contest, put the ad in all the right places like NewPages and Poets&Writers and websites, and let's say they get 300 submissions @ $20 entry fees each. That's $6,000! That's more than enough to print 1,000 or so copies of the book, get it out there, maybe buy an ad or two, and the publisher pockets a cool grand or more. But say they offer a 'big prize' and hardcover publication and they get 500-1000 submissions! $10-20,000, yo. You see where this is going?
Do not be surprised if muumuu youyou holds a book contest, charges $25 with a, "Winner gets half of the entry fees and 100 copies" and they get 700 submissions over six months and the judge is tao lin who picks sarah's 'book' and clams all submissions were blinded and he didn't know even if he wrote everything in the book and 'gave' it to her. Or maybe Richard Yates will be the judge?
This is what these people do. Why? They know there are a lot of hopeful losers out there who will fork over $7-25 for their 'chance.' They laugh to the bank and laugh when the printer sends back the winning 'book' written by toa with sarah's byline, and sarah gets to run around campus saying, 'look at me, i have talent, i'm a hot writer ike my bf!' and brandon and tao kick back and say, 'sweeeeeet' as they divide the rest of the contest entry fees. after printing the book, giving sarah her cut (in beer?), the two bros walk away with $2500 each.
sweet.
funny. this is good. does that make me a bad person
"factually my behavior did not harm anyone outside of guidelines"
ignorance
i read a bunch of the comments just now. but then they get repetitive and consequently uninteresting
i paid $7 and entered my story
i didn't expect to win, so i don't feel pissed or anything i guess
but it does feel shitty but only because it could have been a scam
which, i think, is not to say that i think it was or wasn't a scam
it is to say that i hope it wasn't
i don't know. i think if it is a scam it would be shitty because it's not very clever
i would be okay with it if it was a scam that was clever
i feel weird right now, like i don't know why i'm even typing this
i drank a lot of coffee and i feel depressed and i was a part of this
i feel like plagiarism aside the contest guidelines were technically followed blah blah blah
ok
bye
For the record, I:
1. Thought the winning story was good.
2. Do not feel scammed.
3. Am confused as to why everyone thinks this was some kind of conspiracy. Seems like Tao submitting under another name is an attempt to avoid winning based on his relationship with Brandon.
i just watched the vimeo video of Brandon Scott Gorrell and the other skinny glasses dude who kind of looks like him eating fried chicken together
it made me absolutely sure that muumuu house was a scam and that those two guys were empty shells of humans
these words are in the guidelines, and also in brandon's first comment:
"i have decided to allow people affiliated with 'muumuu house' to join my contest."
after that, there's nothing to talk about. by the rules, tao could enter, tao could win.
and if you thought about it, you would see that he was quite likely to win.
(the whole thing about sarah is a red herring. tao could sign his story "steven king" as long as steven king agreed. sarah agreed to the use of the pen name.)
(that wasn't a trick to get tao into the contest, because according to the rules tao had the right to enter anyway.)
if you read the rules, it was clear that y'all were betting your $7 in a competition against some of brandon's favorite writers and people.
i personally didn't wanna bet $7 on my own odds in that competition.
i don't think writing contests should be run like that, but they always are. one way or another they're always loaded in favor of the friends of the contest-maker.
but brandon's, unlike the usual crooked contest, put the honest information right up front: "i have decided to allow people affiliated with 'muumuu house' to join my contest."
sinec tao won, the money is his. he can keep it, or give it back, or give any percentage of it to sarah, who is supposedly the "owner" of the story and theoretially the owner of the prize.
but that's between him and sarah, isn't it?
This is seriously fucking bullshit.
-Jonathan
seems like the shitstorm has more or less passed by now, but i have a slow metabolism so it's not unusual for me to be late to the party.
the contest guidelines were very direct, and, really, i'm not horribly surprised that my godzilla fan fiction didn't win. but the way all this has played out, i do feel like i got a bit of piss splashed on my pants leg and/or shoe. but it's sort of like the piss was coming out and you were like, 'i'm pissing here,' and i walked right into the stream.
oh well.
i feel like this whole series of comments is a preview of how a war crimes trial of the Bush administration over torture will play out:
"We said we were going to do this."
"Yeah, but it's kinda fucked, if you actually stop and think about it."
"Yeah, but we said we were going to do it."
"Okay."
there is something very lame about posting the value of your checking account in a pathetic hipster play for "street cred." there is a real economic crisis you fucking douche. only the wealthy flaunt their poverty. being fashionably poor is quite different from being actually poor. the truth is that tao lin has 1300 in his checking account and the safety net of family loot. (nyu tuition is 40+k/year, or is he paying off all those student loans with the cash he rakes in from poo-poo house?) see this article for elaboration: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/08/nyregion/08trustafarians.html?_r=2
there is nothing more annoying than hipster assholes trying on poverty as if it were an outfit and then crying starving artist in defense of reprehensible behavior. way to appropriate even the disadvantages of the underclass, you assholes. why not claim you are autistic or have the empathetic capacity of a mosquito and are therefore entitled to be a dick.
i'd like to think that the joy of an artist is, as george bernard shaw said, "to see things that never were and ask, "Why not?" but the winning story reads as if it were written by a computer program designed to approximate human writing by asking the question: i see things that are, and ask what? and once i ascertain the what, how can i make it even more witless?
i guess maybe, as charlie parker said, if you ain't lived it, it won't come out your horn. and since tao and his crew spew forth a constant stream of crap, i'm gonna just have to assume that the life experiences behind those paltry, tepid stories are as sad as the following sentence: "She stood suddenly and dizzily walked in an aimless manner toward a piece of a paper on the dresser."(though you could sub most any excerpt from the story). thanks to you fuckers a whole lot of idiot imitator automatons will now fill their writing-profusely, awkwardly and in a retarded, sometimes aimless manner-with adverbs. cause that's what's wins "contests." and that's a much worse crime than taking seven dollars from somebody.
ps: i am holding another contest. the best shit talking post gets the prize. that is, the post that i feel most cleverly and amusingly talks shit wins. i already know that none of you fools have a retort to this post that's as good as what i just typed, but if you want to enter the contest, go ahead and talk some shit. you've already lost, bitches. let's continue this shitstorm!
For some real true stories about what happens on cruise ship, check out:
www.cruiseshipstories.com
Thanks,
Sean (former crew member)
i think
tao = brandon = ellen = buttercup
hahaha
will this be deleted?
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